Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Jonathan Nelsen on April 3, 2010 at 2:47pm

I am a student studying landscape architecture and to me, it seems like the people in my classes who have pc's are most happy with their functionality and ability to run the majority of design related applications with few problems. Those with macs often ran into problems when trying to install autoCAD, or ArcGIS. I personally always wanted a mac because of the way they look and their music editing software, but the LA departement actually recommended PC's for the LA department, as well as architecture department. In the end, I think you can get macs to run any software you would need, but it comes down to your personal preference, and the ease of installation and use of software.

Jon

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Permalink Reply by Sousuke on April 3, 2010 at 3:11pm

I wouldn't buy a Mac for what you want. There are a few programs that you would be forced to run on a virtual machine which is less than ideal.

I've always built my PCs and found you can build it for half the price of a comparable mac. Some components I hunt down on craigslist etc. like my monitor, video card etc. but core components I always purchase new with their factory warranties.

I also run a 64bit OS which allows for more RAM (32bit maxes out at 3GB) and I haven't run across any compatibility issues yet with any landscape related software.

I've heard that the 32bit version of win7 will show 8GB but apparently doesn't actually take advantage of it.

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Permalink Reply by Brendan Kempf on April 3, 2010 at 7:00pm

Processor speed, as much memory as possible, and a good graphics card are obviously the most important aspects of computer hardware for any design profession. Desktop machines have the benefit of being able to upgraded over time to make use of newer hardware, whereas laptops can not be upgraded beyond more (but usually not better) RAM, and a larger harddrive.

Macs have good hardware across the board...I believe they all use nvidia graphics chips across the board now, which are very powerful chips. Maxing out the ram in these machines can get super pricey, but with a little know-how it usually isn't too hard to get additional ram from newegg.com or the like and save a ton of money. Apple jacks the price way up for ram bought through them. As has already been mentioned, Macs will not run ArcGIS or AutoCAD, and running them under virtualizers and the like is far from ideal, as Sousake mentioned You can dual-boot with windows and just switch between OSes when you need the different apps -- again, far from ideal, especially from a data sharing standpoint. As always you will pay a premium for the "design" of a Mac.

A Windows machine will run all the applications...I don't know of any Mac-only landscape architecture-related apps. And Windows 7 is a huge improvement over all the earlier versions of Windows. You can also build out a comparable Windows desktop or laptop for at least $1k less than a Mac, if not cheaper.

As far as the 64bit / memory issue goes....A 32bit OS is limited to only being able to recognize a little more than 3GB worth of memory, even if you have more installed. A 64bit OS can recognize more ram that you can even fit in any consumer computer. However, it is important to note that in order to use all that ram, the individual programs that you run must be built for 64bit. Otherwise, these programs themselves are similarly limited to about 3GB of memory. Adobe CS4, for instance, is all 32bit (with the exception of a 64bit version of photoshop), so each program is still limited to 3gb for itself. While those individual programs might not be able to take up more ram, you still benefit from having the additional ram and being able to multi-task easily with many programs open at once, which can be veeery helpful.

It's hard to make a recommendation for what kind of computer you should get...It depends on the software you plan on using, and what kind of portability you want to get out of the machine, not to mention budget. If you'll be using mostly Vectorworks, a mac is a safe bet because Adobe apps and sketchup will run just fine on a mac. If you'll be mostly using AutoCAD, go with the Windows computer to save yourself time, money, and hassle. Hope this helps, I'd be more than happy to answer any other questions. (Sorry for the ridiculously long post, haha)

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Permalink Reply by Nick on April 3, 2010 at 10:44pm

I worked on a three year old (when I started my BSLA in 2004) Dell Inspiron 8600 laptop and 3x5 Wacom Graphire tablet.

My former program recommended Mac's and I already had a PC, fortunately. I'm not a computer person per se, but I think I do OK digital work.

My point is that just like anything else having all the fanciest tools still can't replace good art and design fundamentals and practice--dont sweat getting the best software computer, hardware, etc.

I would agree that PC's are the wat to go for LA.

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Permalink Reply by howl on April 4, 2010 at 8:01am

Normally you can get better computer configuration on pc of the same price compare to macbook pro, but if you would like to work at various places (i.e. studio and home) laptop usually is more handy. The reason lots of design students choose mac is its stabiliti (bare case of halted system during work) and high quality screen colour display ability (less variation between the colour on your screen and the colour of the printed plan). You shall notice once you choose mac system, it means you have to give up some programmes: 3D Max, Autocad,GIS etc. unless you use bootcamp to install windows system in ur macbook(I did it). Win7 is not that stable for running 3dmax while windows xp system could not recoginize 4g ram(it means you would only be able to use part of ram of your macbook under win xp which cause lower operation speed). The other option for macbook is you could choose only use mac-friendly programmes: vectorworks landamrk instead autocad, sketchup, photoshop,indesign (they all have mac version)....
hop it helps..good luck!

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Permalink Reply by Jon Quackenbush on April 4, 2010 at 8:37am

How much are you willing to spend?

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Permalink Reply by Jon Quackenbush on April 6, 2010 at 7:05am

Off the top of my head (forgive me if i forget something):
--Tower case - $50 - $100 (Depending on looks, size... think ventilation)
--Power Supply - $75
--Motherboard - $120 - $200
--CPU - $250 - 350 -- Spend the money here, but don't feel like you need the newest, as there often is a gulf in price between "cutting edge" and "yesterdays CPU" that doesn't necessarily translate into that much of a performance increase. Don't forget to buy a heat sink!!! ($40) and thermal grease (Arctic silver - $10)
--Graphics Card - $50 - $350. -- Unless you play a lot of games, don't feel the need to spend $300 here either... good thing about these is there tend to be a lot of user reviews so just read through, become familiar with the on-board memory and other features and make an educated guess. I have a GTS 250 in my machine and it is a beast... they can be had for $100 - $150. Pick a good manufacturer for this for stability & reliability reasons.
--RAM - $50 - $150 -- More is better, do not get less that 2gb
--Peripherals (DVD-R, Card Readers, mice, keyboard) - $150
--Monitor - $200 - $400 -- Size, resolution, refresh rate... the bigger the better for your eyes. Plus you can set it back further if it is larger saving you desk space...
-- Hard Drives -$100 each -- transfer your old ones if you want, or buy new ones. Get two or three, one for your OS and other installed programs, and the other two for storage, backup and archiving. Think high RPM for OS one, size for storage ones.
--Operating system - $150 (I still like XP, but i may be dragging my feet here)

Completed System - $1300 - $2300 with the latter being a beastly rig that you won't have to upgrade for quite a while and the former being nearly as good and likely more than enough for your needs.

--Most important core components that you should spend money on now: Motherboard, CPU, Monitor
--Most easily upgraded in the future: RAM, Graphics Card(s)
--Do research on your Motherboard, as this is the key component to all future upgrades, I just got a new one for $120 and it is a great board. You want a good stable board that is expandable. Plus, make sure the CPU and RAM can be installed before buying... you can't put a round peg in a square hole...
--If you like the look and functionality of the MAC, you can buy after market programs that make the user interface nicer and more intuitive such as ObjectDock ($30)...
--Don't forget anti-virus software... ESET NOD32 is good and inexpensive and uses less memory than norton.

Now brace yourself for how much the professional software is going to cost you.... ouch.

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Permalink Reply by Cemal Onur ALPAY on April 8, 2010 at 3:32am

Thank you for all suggestions.. I have decided to buy a desktop and read all your suggestions about desktops systems. I really don't want to pay lots money for yesterday's technology! I have already got a samsung lcd monitor 21''. Now I have some more questions.

What is better for graphics design systems?
1. Amd or intel chips?
2. Nvidia or ATI graphics cards?

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Permalink Reply by Frank Varro on April 8, 2010 at 7:17am

I would go Intel simply for the fact that they have the i7 chips. As far as ATI vs. InVidia, I haven't researched that lately. I would head over to a site that does benchmarking for gaming and see how the different processors and graphics cards stack up. It always is better to look model by model than brand by brand in general, as there are always crazy outliers on the good and bad sides.

I have never been to this site before now, and therefor have no idea how reliable they are, but they have up to date benchmarking results for a TON of high end and mid-range graphics cards. The one issue I see right away is that they use test data from users, so a lot might depend on the setup being used, and if things were being overclocked. But it should be a good place to start. If I see any other good looking sites I'll let you know.
http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/

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Permalink Reply by Frank Varro on April 9, 2010 at 4:05pm

Ok, This story just popped up today. Its for gaming CPUs, but same general stuff applies for graphic needs. http://gizmodo.com/5513561/the-fastest-gaming-processors-for-any-bu...

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Permalink Reply by Jason T. Radice on April 4, 2010 at 9:23am

Keep in mind, too, that a majority of the software is written for PC, and updated first for PC. This includes Adobe, suprisingly, as Adobe is graphics software, the dominant realm of the Mac. You can get a much better machine for the price, better compatibility, and you can easily upgrade a pc with a new board or processor (if you buy the right one), wihout having to shell out another two thousand dollars on a totally new Mac. Essentially, you can get a new machine for 300 bucks if you buy components.

I've used both, and hands down prefer PCs. They are simply better number crunchers, which is what you need for CAD and 3D software.

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Permalink Reply by Sousuke on April 4, 2010 at 8:08pm

If you are thinking about buying components here is a list of sites you might try:

www.pricewatch.com
www.newegg.com
www.3btech.net

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