Any areas in the country seeing growth / new jobs?

[Jay Smith]

I’m sorry to beat a dead horse here, but has anyone heard of any particular areas of the country doing better than others for new hires?

This job market is absolutely shocking to me. I’ve been looking for a Landscape Architect position for nearly 18 months, and just can’t find anything (and I’m looking all over the u.s.). Not even an interview. I created a new portfolio with a website recently in hopes of setting myself apart, sent out resumes to another 150 firms this past week, and nothing. No interest. (4 years ago, I would have had at least 5-10 serious responses from that kind of effort).

For the first time in my life I’d have to say I’m pretty scared about the future. I never could have fathomed an economic climate in which my degree (with nearly 10 years of experience) does me no good. People keep saying “oh it will get better, just wait”, but seriously…..many economists are predicting it could take years for this country to reach pre-recession level unemployment.

If anyone here (who has actually had to go out and find a position in this particular recession) has personally experienced or has seen some success, I’d appreciate any tips or encouragement you can pass along.

[Jay Smith]

I hear what you’re saying about the volume, but this method has worked quite well for me in the past. I do try to tailor the cover letter to the firm I’m applying for as much as I can. But most often, information about that particular firm is limited. Unless you happen to know someone who works there, your information on a firms needs can be extremely limited. 150 sounds like a lot, but believe me, a lot of time went into preparing that many cover letters. It took me about 3 weeks to put all that together. (After about 6 weeks of building a website/portfolio).

As far as networking. I realize now in this recession how important it is. But unfortunately I don’t have a huge network. Obviously I can get involved in some volunteer organizations to try to connect with some people. But the reality is, you can’t create a huge network of colleagues on a moments notice. It’s just a tough lesson I’ve learned during this, which does me little good at the present time (but hopefully more good in the long run).

I do apply for actual jobs (many of them), but from what I’m hearing, those places are literally overwhelmed with applicants, and they surely have the creme of the crop to choose from. I’m not in the top 10% of my profession in terms of skills, so I’m at a huge disadvantage when it comes to advertised jobs. Not to sound like I’m down on myself, I’m just honest with myself about what I have to offer compared to other applicants who have had more of a well rounded working experience.

I think its great that you’ve had some interviews. But if I may be blunt, you are probably seen as that top 10% that I’m competing against. You have a very impressive cd package you are sending out, and you are no doubt turning some heads with it ( I remember discussing that with you a few months ago). I’d say all those hours you put into are really paying off and you definetely have an advantage over the average applicant like myself who probably has more of a modest portfolio.

But I do appreciate your comments. And I’m glad you are having some luck, I just wish these employers would get off the fence and start hiring again.

[Jay Smith]

I do do my homework on these firms and weave it into the application package. However, like I said, there is only so much you can learn from the net. Often times websites offer a very broad overview of a firm’s services and project-types. And more often than not, these websites aren’t updated to reflect a firms current focus during this unique time.

I hope you are not taking offense to my observations. My intentions were to compliment you on your efforts. But I do think your initial presentation package is making a big difference. First impressions are everything when a firm has a stack of resume’s to sort through for one job opening, and nothing else to go on when considering an applicant. I too am passionate about finding a job, have taken numerous risks during this ordeal, and have tried a variety of approaches. I would step up my game if I knew what else to try, passion alone isn’t getting it done.

[nca]

Jay,

I’ve seen at least a handful of positions open up and advertised in other regions of the US and abroad for more experienced professionals. Most, if not all of them have been advertising a need from someone with more than five years experience and licensure, so I havent even bothered applying. I’ve seen a *few* entry level positions pop up fairly recently, but they’ve either been in places I really dont want to live or I didn’t even get a reply for sending in my materials.

150 firms seems like a lot. I think I’ve applied to maybe a couple dozen firms in the past 6 months, if that. I know some people who have had success applying for govt jobs recently.

An ad went up for a entry level position a couple weeks ago with Hargreaves in San Francisco. I think I caught it on the first day it went up on ASLA. I cant even imagine how many emails, cover letters and resumes they got in response to that ad. I didn’t even get a courtesy email.

I don’t care what anyone says, it’s tough. I have what I would consider a large network for an ‘entry level’ person and a strong skill set and there’s just nothing in my region anyway. I may have better luck if I would consider moving to Tampa, or Connecticut, but I just don’t see the point.

Hopefully, my next effort coming shortly will be more fruitful.

[nca]

Nick-

Besides the interviews, have you had any serious nibbles? Were they prospective employers in your region or elsewhere?

[Jay Smith]

I hear what you’re saying. But the only downside to spending that much time tailoring one’s application to a specific company is that you are not making contact with as many firms. I think both methods ‘increase the odds’ of getting a call back, but it’s hard to say which way is more worthwhile. A couple of years ago, I would occassionally test the market by sending out 20-30 hardcopy portfolios, and I would always get at least a couple of interview requests from doing so. Of course this was back in the boom, but the presentation of my credentials was not as impressive as what I have now. I feel like I have stepped up my game during this recession, but it’s just not working.

I think you have a good method for tailoring your application though. And I don’t mean to sound skepticle about it. In fact, I’ll probably start spending a little more time on that aspect, as I having nothing to lose at this point.

But, I would be willing to bet, that when it comes down to getting an employers attention, the two most important factors are:

1) Does this applicant have the exact skills I am looking for, so I don’t have to spend time training him or her.

2) What about this applicant is different from the other 20 applicants that are qualified (considering I have nothing else to go on about this applicant). I think that’s where an impressive portfolio comes in to play. Sure, mentioning in the cover letter some projects the firm has worked on and how they relate to the applicants past experience might help, but I’d put my money on the portfolio. And I think that’s probably where you are standing out over any other applicants with a similar skill/experience background.

Are you only sending your materials to places that are advertising? I’ve always felt my odds were better targeting firms that aren’t running ads. I used to cold call such companies (again, before the recession) and I can’t even tell you how many times I would end up on the phone with an owner telling me “well, you called at a good time, because we were just getting ready to place an ad”. I guess that’s part of the reasoning behind my approach, I’m trying to find these new opening before they go public.

[Jay Smith]

Hey Nick,

You’re right, its tough. What I have found is that more firms want licensure right now. (Something I do not have. The best I can do is assure them I am working towards it). Many firms also want 3-D modeling experience. (Something else I don’t have. I’m trying to teach myself as much as I can online, but I just don’t have the experience many people have coming out of school).

As far as the Gov’t jobs, there seem to be a lot right now. But what I’ve found is that they seem to want very specific experience and specific skill sets. I have yet to find one that I’m completely qualified for. And when I do, then they also want licensure, it’s always something.

Good luck with your upcoming push though. I hope we all get out of this mess soon.

[nca]

So basically everywhere.

[nca]

I don’t see how one could possibly do this right now unless you’re appplying all over the globe. There just aren’t that many positions advertised unless you’re canvassing in some form. I like to think I have a pretty good handle on where to look for jobs and who to watch and I just don’t see anything out there right now. The positions I’m seeing advertised, as I stated earlier, are for far more experienced professionals than myself or in a different region.

I’d also add that every job I’ve had in the landscape/design industry came from a cold call or email for a position not being advertised. I can sympathize with Jay here regarding cold calling and canvassing portfolios with fair success. But then they say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results..I guess.

I guess what the moral of the story and what Nick is trying to convey here is that we all probably need to adapt, though I also completely recognize and have come to terms with the fact that this is an anomolous economic climate. Just digging your heels in and charging forward with yuour head down just doesnt work like I’ve xperienced anymore. It doesn’t matter if you tailored your cover letter to each firm if there’s no backlog of work. Thats what I’ve encountered in the Denver area. may be different elsewhere.

Chances are more than likely there ARE jobs out there, it seems though its more a matter of perfect timing and being in the right place at the right time. Though this requires that we be somewhere doing something rather than on the dole. There’s a saying in the advertising industry- there’s no such thing as bad publicity- which is essentially what we’re doing when we advertise our abilities via portfolio, email, land8lounge, whatever, publicizing ourselves, our work.

[nca]

I actually applied to a few government jobs which I was way underqualified for just to see what they were looking for and found, as you mentioned, very specific requirements. Not to mention those apps only take about an hour to complete.

[Charlie Robinson]

Hey Nick !!

For what its worth ….One word PERSISTANCE!! i honestly think that the individuals who are gettin the jobs are not necessarily the most talented …but the most persistent …which is shame in one sence !!! I graduated in aug 08 …and within weeks …promising interviews..even job offers ..Turned to nothing!!! …So i broadened my search from Ireland to U.K….. similar response…. so i broadened my search to…. well ANYWHERE where theres a landscape architecture institute body to be honest…..my gmail account capacity was full !!! im talkin hundreds of emails !!! Thankfully i got a few offers and im here in Canberra Australia now. il say this cautiously …but there are opportunities in OZ ….with the stimulus package and the fact that Australia “technically” only went into a recession for a brief period in April-may, means that there are opportunities on the AILA website …..

Your Portfolio looks fantastic m8 …to be honest far better than my own..and most others in my opinion !!! you will find work im sure of that !!! it just might not be your ideal environment or firm -its a matter of whether one is willing to immigrate ..Take on the challenge of working abroad….which it is !! 😀 ..But worthwhile.!!
Waiting out a recession is a bad idea in my opinion …more and more grads a coming out each year …some of my class m8s are doin masters ….so don’t waste your talent Nick …like I said you might not get an ideal position where as a few years ago ..we could pick and choose where we wanted to go!! …but that’s the reality were in right now !!!

Best of Luck !

[Ryan A. Waggoner]

Hey Jay,
I definitely understand your struggles. I have less experience, and have had to fight to get the two jobs I’ve had since graduating. The only real opportunities I’ve had came from personally banging doors down. I was sending out portfolios and applications like crazy and getting mild responses or feedback at best. When I finally showed up and talked to employers I’ve had great acceptance and job offers. I’m not sure why that is, I’m assuming that the market is flooded with many people in the same position and the firms that are somehow weathering the storm have the pick of the litter. That being said, no matter how impressive your work, it is still extremely difficult to make a great impression via the internet or thru snail mail. I think that showing up to an office to see where they are currently standing is the best way to get noticed. It also allows you to get an impression of the office and atmosphere. It’s a tough time, and I agree that we’re years off the standard we were at two years ago as a profession. I wish you all the best luck Jay.

[Jay Smith]

Nrschmid, I don’t know about my reputation being soured that way. In this economy I’m sure its fairly common for multiple firms in the same town to receive materials from the same applicant. There’s nothing unusual about that.

I will agree with you that I’d probably have a better chance at finding a position through networking, but like I said previously, I just don’t have much of a network, and you can’t build one overnight.

I guess by ‘barely advertised’ your speaking of listings that go up on sites other than the more popular national sites. I’ve been hitting quite a few, and have discovered quite a few I didn’t know existed prior to this search. But keep in mind, just because a position isn’t advertised, doesn’t mean it’s not ‘open’. Sometimes it’s just a matter of making contact at the right time.

[Jay Smith]

Good Points Aceto.

[Jay Smith]

Hey Charlie, any advice as to where one would get started in looking at jobs in Australia? Did they require you to have your papers in order prior to applying?

[Author]

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