Occupy Wall Street – Are you with it?

[landplanner]

I like the Constitution myself, I just don’t maintain a strict and rigid interpretation of it, as if it were some immortal dictatum, frozen and forever at the time of its drafting and adoption.

Whether we like it or we don’t, were all crewmembers on USS America Without a Rudder, but we all have paddles. We should use them individually, and collectively  (there is that socialist word again !) to row in the same direction.

 If you can tolerate yourself William, than you  can handle the minor suffering I might have barely caused you here.

Thanks for the good tidings and right back at you.

 

[landplanner]

 

 

“But when you have eliminated the impossible, as Sherlock Holmes told Watson, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth”

Ross Douhat NYT columnist 

Or as a more familiar line goes….“Somewhere between your version and my own, lies the truth”

This article along with some fairly indisputable statistics and charts, lean in the direction of the truths and what the people who populate the OWS movement are more than just a little tweaked about.

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/here-is-more-substantial-data-behind-the-occupy-wall-street-movement-2011-10?op=1

 

 

                                                                                                                                                                

[Steve Mercer]

Yes there is a group of Americans who are not just worried about the here and now.  This group of Americans not only look at the individual trees in the forrest but the WHOLE forrest.  We as Americans cannot continue to spend our way out of this national crisis that we are in.  At some point someone has to hold the line on the out of control spending that is occuring in Washington.  Or your grandchildren will be in such a finacial hole that it will be impossible to climb out of.  I make no apologies for supporting such a notion.  When economic times are tough it is not the time to go on a spending spree personally or nationally. 

s.

[Anonymous]

So I guess what you’re telling me that the best thing to do for our future children is to do nothing but give tax breaks for the wealthy and squash government regulation?

 

I agree with you, now is not the time to go on a spending spree, but it is a time to spend wisely. Just like a poor person would be wise to spend the money it takes to keep their home from collapsing. I’m sorry it makes no sense to have millions of healthy people sitting idle and collecting unemployment checks while our infrastructure falls apart. I guess the alternative is to cut their unemployment benefits and allow them to become beggars and criminals.

 

We are about to create a perfect storm here in this country. Laying off teachers and cops at the same time we’re creating an increase in the population of desperate people. Believe me I’m no bleeding heart liberal, but there comes a point when the government has to step in and do something for the people that want to help themselves.

                                                                                                

My wife and I are doing ok, but I still feel the pain of my once hard working Americans that are suffering while criminal Fat Cats get fatter. It makes me sick.

[Anonymous]

Scary. It sounds like a great way to drive a polarized country further apart.

[Anonymous]

That’s an interesting description. I always looked at him as an A-type personality dude that spoke the truth, even though it made me whence sometimes. The professor isn’t so scary; he’s just a little rough around the edges. I respect guys like him as well as ones like Alexander Haig and Ron Paul. What circle would I fit in? Hopefully it’s the thinking American circle.

[Steve Mercer]

I wonder if you have ever run a business Craig.  Any business owner will tell you that they have fought hard to get where they are.  There is a wealthy elite class and there are the wealthy on paper.  By the time you add up all the commitments and responsibilities shouldered by many business owners they are not making as much as you think.  Capital is hard to come by especially right now.  You don’t think somebody of a General Electric status would be going to Warren Buffet for capital if things weren’t really bad out there do you?  Have you tried to borrow money from a bank lately?  Anyone who has money has to work twice as hard to keep someone else from taking it away from them.  I find it distainful that you would insuate that someone who has fought and worked hard to build up their fortune are now somehow criminal.  If that were so then why is it that people all over the world perfer to come to American more than any other country?  Our system may be flawed but it is still better than anywhere else you will live.  I still have a hard time figuring out why you want to protest against Wall Street.  Wall Street does not set the rules the government does.   Given, Wall Street has poured a lot of money into Washington and may have gamed the system.  But you are protesting to the wrong people.  I would think you would be more interested in marching on Washington.  If enough people March and protest in Washington long enough and you follow that up with voting out incumbents of both parties.  The influence that Wall Street has in Washingtion will be diminished.  I think that is the goal your movement should be concerned about.  If you were a Doctor you are treating the patients symptoms not the disease.

I personally am not happy with either party.  Rand Paul is my Senator,  and I voted for him,  Not because I believe in everything he stands for.  I voted for him to send a clear message to Washington that it is NOT business as usual and if both parties keep it up there will be more people like Rand Paul holding seats in Washington and power that each party now enjoys will be diminished.  That has already occured in the Republican Party.  The Vice President was interviewed on CBS this morning and said that there is a new arm of the Republican Party and it is not like the Party that the Dems are use to dealing with.  I say great we have now got their attention!  How much more political blood needs to be spilt before those who are left straight up and fly right?  It would help if the Democratic Party had a similar movement afoot.  It is time to try something different.  What has always been ain’t work’in no more!  I say if the American people has to throw every incumbent in office (Dem or Rep) out for new blood, so be it if that is what it is going to get control of our government.

 

s.

[Steve Mercer]

I would say that Mr. Madoff is reaping what he sowed right now don’t you think?  He is likely to die in prison that in my opinion is far worse that shooting him.  Losing ones freedom for the rest of your life is a pretty stiff penalty don’t you think?

 

s.

[Anonymous]

Steve – to answer your first question I started my LA firm in 2008 and I’ve been grinding everyday to live the American dream. I’m not anti-business or against people becoming rich. I’m against dirtbags getting rich from misleading people. And gambling away regular working people’s money, but not being penalized for it. When it comes to business I’m a shark, but I’m a shark that plays the game as fairly as I can. Someone that pulls themselves up from their bootstraps and makes it happen is a role model to me. Provided they didn’t make their money by cheating people and abusing employees.  

 

In previous posts on this thread I have stated that even though I support the OWS in general I wouldn’t join them until they were ready to go to Washington. I also said that, I can’t get too angry with Wall St. because they’re just doing what they do, making money. So it seems like you read more into what I was saying and stuck me into the bleeding heart liberal box anyway.

 

I’m not a part of any movement and I’m not a democrat or republican. I’m a common sense Independent American that’s tired of the status quo.

[Steve Mercer]

It sounds like we have more in common that we do differences Craig.

 

s.

[Anonymous]

We do indeed and I’m cool with that.

[landplanner]

The wordy weight of the debate in this thread has become a little overbearing. I have contributed my fair share.

Time to lighten things up a bit. I offer this in that regard.

 

http://www.sfgate.com/columnists/fiore/

[Anonymous]

Thanks Rob, but I left myself open for that one while I was longing for yesteryear. I get caught up sometimes when I think about the great things this country has accomplished.

 

I just expect America to always be number one and making moves to stay number one. Pardon the sports analogy, but when I was a kid I remember Muhammad Ali playing rope-a-dope. He would curl up and look pitiful, taking a pummeling on his shoulders and arms for a couple of rounds, but eventually he would wear down his opponent and come out swinging. It was a beautiful thing to watch when he would come back and win the fight. I think America has taken a pounding for too long and we need to start throwing punches before we lose the fight.

 

I’m not saying that we should be trying to go about things the way China is right now. They still have some catching up to do. Their environment and people are paying a price for the way they’re going about developing their country. It’s just hard for me to believe that the best thing for our government to do is… basically do nothing or do more of the same.

[Jon Quackenbush]

This is a perfect economic summary of what fuels the growing body that is the Occupy movement, thanks.

The power elite have desperately tried to tar the movement with a series of calumnies, branding protesters as hippies, anti-Semites, drug addicts, leftists, anarchists and communists. They have so far been unable to blunt the fundamental truth the movement imparts: We have undergone a corporate coup. It has to be reversed.

 

[Heather Smith]

Fines are still apart of government regulation…I see no difference in that. Want to push for campaign finance reform? Me too…that is why I am protesting. 🙂

In response to a previous post by I believe William…I am reading Adam Smith’s, The Wealth of Nations, and find it interesting that the economist that put forth the idea of free market capitalism acknowledges that businesses still need regulation.

“in every improved and civilized society, this is the state into which…the great body of the peole must necessarily fall, unless government takes some pains to prevent it.”

What I would like to see is a little less hysteria by both sides regarding the opinions of others. We are arrogant if we assume that “our” side has all of the answers. Instead of the name calling why can’t we lay down our battle axes and find real solutions. Because the fact is we all face the same inequality when it comes to our voices being heard. There is nothing extreme about wanting American citizens to have a say in the way our country is being run. The level of passion OWS has managed to incite tells me the movement is on to something. Recently a group has been attacked by a knife wielding man yelling at protestors to find a job, people have been threatened with guns and a bomb was thrown into an Occupy camp. Police have been taped BEATING people and pepper spraying non violent protesters. They come out against them like they are waging a war. People always say the media is liberal…we have all learned a little bit about corporate control of media that slants the movement as disorganized all the way over to a highly organized communist movement. We recieve much the same treatment as Ron Paul…pretend he/we aren’t here. Pretend we don’t have valid complaints and are representative of a large portion of our population. We had counter protesters from the Tea Party over a week ago that realized they agreed with us. One kid was trying to figure out how he would explain to his Tea Party friends why he was joing OWS. So here is an idea. If you think the movement doesn’t represent you…go down and represent yourself. You have the ability to direct the debate…but it is a lot easier to sit behind a computer screen and pontificate on everything a group of disorganized individuals do wrong. Protesting is not fun. It isn’t a party here. We are tired. Tired of apathy. Tired of being called communists. Tired of being smeared.

The irony is that we continue to this day to see policy passed that benefits the banks. Can we talk about that? Because everything else is distraction. While people sit back and mock people we are still propping up banks, we are still left holding the bag…it is a joke.

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